Loyalty vs Revenue

[Hawkstar33]

We are currently Elite, and will be Elite Plus, by end of next years 5 cruises.  18 yrs of cruising, with a balcony, some in concierge, depending on the deal we received. I previously upgraded my next 6 cruises, to concierge before we get on each ship.  Not really much difference in the room, other then location. Possibly a few pillow choices, some canapés, and disembarking perks.  But we do get 2 pts per night extra, towards our goal. And Yes, we will get the extra laundry bag perk, LOL. So anyway, we just got back from a BTB on beautiful Summit. I wrote her a glowing, well deserved, review.   Ship was full, first part of trip, while second part was gonna be half capacity.  Gonna be rooms open, I said.  Great.  Let's go talk to guest relations about an upgrade.  Tried that first. Nope. Gotta go to future cruise counselor, who can help you.  Ok no problem ty.  Have read about others doing this, so was excited to see what we could get, being the ship was half full.  I asked what the upgrade would be from deluxe balcony, to concierge, and was told he couldn't give me a price because I booked thru a travel group, and would need to contact them to upgrade. OK. Next step, try to contact them from ship computer at sea.  Was able to get thru to them, and long story short, was rather taken back by the price. $1500 plus loss of my OBC,  which was $450.  And not budging according to my cruise counselor, who always gets me great deals. Bothered me a lot to say the least, but too much money to switch, so forget it.  Not quite yet.  Was going into a theater show and saw an officer, who just happened to be Head of Customer Relations. Very nice young lady.  I took a moment to tell her about my attempt, and our customer loyalty, and thought she could possibly help.  Sadly. I was wrong again.  She proceeded to tell me how the upgrade thing, is strictly a matter of revenue, and customer loyalty, has nothing to do with it. Even on an empty ship.  Surprised by her answer, but I should've known better, that it's all about $$$$.  So much for highly touted customer appreciation, and guest service.  I was willing to pay a reasonable amount. So this is my personal experience on trying to upgrade while onboard the ship. 

[MisterMet]

Benjamin’s. Benjamins. Benjamin’s!   You had to give it a shot though.

[Lastdance]

Yes, it is all about revenue, supply/demand and not loyalty.  We were going to do a Move-up from our TA(suite) to a suite from our SV, but Celebrity wanted the highest Move-up amount, so we said, politely…”no thank you!”  This time we were so glad we did, as our SV was such a great deal, along with enjoying our smaller cabin, but our butler/cabin attendant staying in touch.  Also, we met a wonderful couple that eating with is such a pleasure…keeps us laughing.  This time it was meant to be!  Revenue is a huge driving force; we also own stock and are elite+.  We do know of quite a few on our cruise who were offered free move ups and shared that with us…

Edited May 11, 2023 by Lastdance

[mahdnc]

9 minutes ago, Hawkstar33 said:

We are currently Elite, and will be Elite Plus, by end of next years 5 cruises.  18 yrs of cruising, with a balcony, some in concierge, depending on the deal we received. I previously upgraded my next 6 cruises, to concierge before we get on each ship.  Not really much difference in the room, other then location. Possibly a few pillow choices, some canapés, and disembarking perks.  But we do get 2 pts per night extra, towards our goal. And Yes, we will get the extra laundry bag perk, LOL. So anyway, we just got back from a BTB on beautiful Summit. I wrote her a glowing, well deserved, review.   Ship was full, first part of trip, while second part was gonna be half capacity.  Gonna be rooms open, I said.  Great.  Let's go talk to guest relations about an upgrade.  Tried that first. Nope. Gotta go to future cruise counselor, who can help you.  Ok no problem ty.  Have read about others doing this, so was excited to see what we could get, being the ship was half full.  I asked what the upgrade would be from deluxe balcony, to concierge, and was told he couldn't give me a price because I booked thru a travel group, and would need to contact them to upgrade. OK. Next step, try to contact them from ship computer at sea.  Was able to get thru to them, and long story short, was rather taken back by the price. $1500 plus loss of my OBC,  which was $450.  And not budging according to my cruise counselor, who always gets me great deals. Bothered me a lot to say the least, but too much money to switch, so forget it.  Not quite yet.  Was going into a theater show and saw an officer, who just happened to be Head of Customer Relations. Very nice young lady.  I took a moment to tell her about my attempt, and our customer loyalty, and thought she could possibly help.  Sadly. I was wrong again.  She proceeded to tell me how the upgrade thing, is strictly a matter of revenue, and customer loyalty, has nothing to do with it. Even on an empty ship.  Surprised by her answer, but I should've known better, that it's all about $$$$.  So much for highly touted customer appreciation, and guest service.  I was willing to pay a reasonable amount. So this is my personal experience on trying to upgrade while onboard the ship. 

 

Thank you for sharing your experience and I understand where you are coming from since the ship was sailing so empty.  If you had been upgraded, you might not have been awarded the +2 points/night bump that you were seeking anyway (that's true with getting upgraded through MoveUp).

[Hawkstar33]

1 minute ago, mahdnc said:

 

Thank you for sharing your experience and I understand where you are coming from since the ship was sailing so empty.  If you had been upgraded, you might not have been awarded the +2 points/night bump that you were seeking anyway (that's true with getting upgraded through MoveUp).

TY. Yes you are correct about moveup  points,   But we would've gotten the points, only because I was only able  to upgrade thru my cruise travel group.  Thus making me eligible for the extra points.  

[jwlane]

This is a problem with loyalty programs---using that status to expect something for nothing, then get offended when it doesn't happen.

[WrittenOnYourHeart]

Sounds like the problem was that you booked through an agency's block of rooms more than anything else. Had you not done that you likely would have been able to upgrade easier.

[bEwAbG]

I bet that the ability to do this on the ship is severely curtailed by corporate.  It's a strategy they introduced a year or two before the pandemic to not offer rooms at fire sale prices and try to force people into paying for upgrades through a dedicated program.  Knowing that the front desk person could bump you up for little or no cost would eventually decrease demand for the move-up revenue stream.  They send you to future cruise sales so that person can give you the going rate as if you had tried to do it before getting on the ship.  Also why you don't hear much about the "upgrade fairy" anymore, unless they really need the specific room you're already booked in.  In short, they make more money by not having many exceptions and would rather sail with an empty room than devalue (according to them) its worth.

[omeinv]

1) You booked through a travel agency, and then were disappointed when Celebrity expects you to service the reservation through the agency they had paid a commission to service your needs. 

 

2) You wanted a bargain price on an unsold room, but Celebrity would have several reasons not to sell you the higher category room at a fire-sale price: They don't increase actual passengers aboard, since you're vacating a room to move; therefore no increase in onboard spending.  If they sel you a room at a price low enough to make you happy, it devalues the category.  This is akin to why airlines don't allow passengers to move to empty Economy Plus or First Class seats.  Others have paid full price. If they learn that they could have gotten the same thing by waiting and paying much less, that devalues the product.  The cruise line has to consider this while customers usually do not. 

 

The fact that you're "Elite" is taken into account if you make a Move Up Offer, beyond that what effect would you hope for?  While many go on about the value of their "loyalty", the fact is generally the more experienced cruiser spends less on board than the first timer.  Witness the fact you had used your knowledge of the next sailing's capacity to try to angle for a deal.  The new cruiser likely wouldn't have known to question the next sailing's passenger count. 

 

Harris

Denver, CO

 

[sanger727]

I'm really not sure why there's an entitlement to get an upgrade at a bargain due to loyalty. If you called them to book a cruise that was $2,000 pp would you ask to pay $1,500 because of your loyalty?

Edited May 11, 2023 by sanger727

[Hawkstar33]

Instead of quoting you all, I will respond to each together.  Jw, I never expected something for nothing, was willing to pay a fair increase, but was disappointed at the end result. Nor was I offended because of status.  I never tried to do this onboard before, so didn't realize I had to go back thru my agent, and didn't understand the devaluation as pointed out by Harris.  My attempt, once I heard of the upcoming low capacity, was to jump at the opportunity of half booked room openings, and yes, hopes of a good deal. Having read several threads in relation to this, I was still unsure of how it worked. And the rest is history.  Now I do understand. But I also feel that it doesn't hurt to let them know that you have been there many times, for what ever it may be worth down the line. In the OLD days, Loyalty used to mean something.  Now like everything else, it's being erased. 

[Orator]

I've never been offered a discount and I've been upgraded only once in 110 Celebrity cruises. I wouldn't expect a discount based on my loyalty. When LLP became CEO loyalty changed as evidenced by the former head of the Loyalty Department and her assistant leaving.  No longer a Celebrity Loyalist since the recent changes.

Edited May 11, 2023 by Orator

[jelayne]

Curious as to why you didn’t do a Move Up bid when they were offered.  We were also on that B2B and a number of people bidding on Concierge and Verandas had success with getting their bids accepted.

[swjumbo]

I’m normally one who disagrees with the frequent travellers expecting more than the rest who have paid the same but this time I agree with the OP.

What’s wrong with giving you a cheeky little upgrade on a half empty ship?

Absolutely nothing.

Many years ago it happened but nowadays people are too scared in the corporate ‘all seeing’ world to do anything on their own initiative.

[hcat]

15 minutes ago, jelayne said:

Curious as to why you didn’t do a Move Up bid when they were offered.  We were also on that B2B and a number of people bidding on Concierge and Verandas had success with getting their bids accepted.

 

agree..this is the way upgrades work these days.  we book a cabin we like and do not bid.. and would not expect  to snag an upgrade on board...

[Orator]

Happiness formula: M/E=H. Keep your Motivations high and your Expectations low and you will find Happiness.

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, Hawkstar33 said:

Instead of quoting you all, I will respond to each together.  Jw, I never expected something for nothing, was willing to pay a fair increase, but was disappointed at the end result. Nor was I offended because of status.  I never tried to do this onboard before, so didn't realize I had to go back thru my agent, and didn't understand the devaluation as pointed out by Harris.  My attempt, once I heard of the upcoming low capacity, was to jump at the opportunity of half booked room openings, and yes, hopes of a good deal. Having read several threads in relation to this, I was still unsure of how it worked. And the rest is history.  Now I do understand. But I also feel that it doesn't hurt to let them know that you have been there many times, for what ever it may be worth down the line. In the OLD days, Loyalty used to mean something.  Now like everything else, it's being erased. 

What they got was a fair offer thr difference between what they paid and the price the room would have sold for. Pretty standard on all of the lines. They have upgrade programs before the cruise.

 

Loyalty has nothing to do with price paid outside of the pre cruise upgrade program and that benefit is a priority in case of equal bids, not a reduced price.

[Guest ldtr]

1 hour ago, swjumbo said:

I’m normally one who disagrees with the frequent travellers expecting more than the rest who have paid the same but this time I agree with the OP.

What’s wrong with giving you a cheeky little upgrade on a half empty ship?

Absolutely nothing.

Many years ago it happened but nowadays people are too scared in the corporate ‘all seeing’ world to do anything on their own initiative.

Actually there is. It creates the expectation that one can save money by booking a cheaper cabin and then getting a cheap upgrade on board. Better to defend the price point and make it clear that you get what you book and pay for.

[phoenix_dream]

To me the biggest proof that loyalty and pricing aren't compatible anymore is what happened with all the free Blue Chip cruises offered to people who haven't cruised with Celebrity in quite awhile and perhaps only once or twice.  If anything irked me that did.  (I am not talking about the people who actually earn the free cruises by all the gambling they do - I'm talking about exactly the opposite kind of people - those that rarely cruise and hardly gamble).  

 

As someone who has sailed 70+ times with Celebrity over 30 years I do wish that very loyal cruisers would get some kind of pricing benefit.  And I guess technically we do because as a Zenith I think when I bid for upgrades my bid is increased 2% I think it is.  Wow.  2%.  I don't expect it, and I know these days I won't get it.  Just saying it would be a nice perk.

[Hawkstar33]

2 hours ago, jelayne said:

Curious as to why you didn’t do a Move Up bid when they were offered.  We were also on that B2B and a number of people bidding on Concierge and Verandas had success with getting their bids accepted.

Move up was available, but does not come with the added points per day, if you win your bid. 

[Georgia_Peaches]

Your story convinces me more than ever that my philosophy of not chasing loyalty points but best deal instead, is the right one for us.  While I do enjoy the Elite perks, they are not enough to keep me coming back if I find a better deal for my desired itinerary on another cruise line.  We currently have 3 cruises on the books with Celebrity but they are there because I found a good deal.  We have 2 others on the books with MSC (whose loyalty perks are abysmal, IMO) because the price was right for Yacht club and the itineraries are ones we continue to enjoy.  I wish your story had had a nicer ending but I commend the officer for giving it to you straight.  She could have given you a fluff story but she didn't.  Good on her.  Thanks for sharing your experience.

[George C]

I think move up has stopped any or at least most of free upgrades, my very first celebrity cruise we got a free upgrade to a suite. I am not loyal but really like celebrity suite perks so will continue to sail them, also rccl oasis class because of great entertainment plus diamond plus perks and MSc yacht club love there ship within a ship concept, they also give me a ten percent discount for being a veteran.

[Orator]

52 minutes ago, George C said:

I think move up has stopped any or at least most of free upgrades, my very first celebrity cruise we got a free upgrade to a suite. I am not loyal but really like celebrity suite perks so will continue to sail them, also rccl oasis class because of great entertainment plus diamond plus perks and MSc yacht club love there ship within a ship concept, they also give me a ten percent discount for being a veteran.

First time cruisers may get an upgrade to encourage future bookings. I got one on my first cruise with Crystal. Based in marketing, not loyalty. 

[mayleeman]

Can you go online on the first part of a B2B and transfer your 2nd leg booking to another (upgraded) cabin? Perhaps with the $100/pp fee? Or is it too late by then?

[Nachosdelux]

cruise lines (like airline and hotel programs) see loyalty programs as a liability (necessary evil)

 

Revenue is king and frankly all that really matters to these travel companies. 

 

Anyone that believes differently is frankly kidding themselves about their value to the company.

 

"what have you done for me lately" is all that matters.  Believe it.

Edited May 11, 2023 by Nachosdelux