PRINCESS SHIPS & CORONA VIRUS

[npcl]

1 hour ago, Tamerton said:

I think you could park a ship for say 4 months with very few costs involved and the bottom dollar may be better than sailing half empty ships.

From CCL's last annual filing

 

Annual Revenue    20, 825  million

Operating Income  3,276   million

 

So they do have a lot of cash flow

 

However,  if one looks at their balance sheet.

 

At the end of their last fiscal year the amount of prepaid fares that they have (would be the same pretty much any time)

Customer Deposits    4,735 million

Current potion of long term debt 1,596 million

Accounts Payable  756 million

These plus a few other add up to

Total Current Liabilities  9,127 Million

 

On the other hand 

Cash on hand  518 million

Trade and other receivables  444 million

Inventories   427 million

Prepaid expenses 671 million

all adding up to total current assets  2,059 million

 

Bottom line is any substantial stoppage in operations, even just refunding the existing customer deposits would more than wipe out current assets.   Cruise lines have a lot of money tied up in equipment, have a lot of long term debt.  They bring in a lot of revenue, but any substantial stoppage and they get into trouble quickly.

 

They would certainly have lines of credit available, but they need ongoing cash flow from ongoing operations. Even if they idle ships, they pretty much have to keep some engineering crew on board, keep systems running and maintained.  One of the reasons you see cruise lines continue to operate ships that are for sale right up until day of transfer to the buyer.  

Edited February 13, 2020 by npcl

[npcl]

51 minutes ago, brisalta said:

 

A couple of years ago the Salesforce Convention in San Francisco could not find enough hotel rooms so to get additional rooms they chartered a cruise ship that just remained tied to the dock throughout the conference. I am sure the line made extra profit as it did not have to burn bunker fuel to move the ship around.

I can imagine some ships in some locations being used as temporary docked hotels in future.

However, if you get a spread of this outbreak to the point where it has a major impact on cruise lines, do you think anyone will need ships for extra hotel event space?

[Aus Traveller]

1 minute ago, npcl said:

However, if you get a spread of this outbreak to the point where it has a major impact on cruise lines, do you think anyone will need ships for extra hotel event space?

I recall that the Japanese Olympic Committee has chartered at least one ship to use for accommodation during the Olympics this year.

[ClearyCreek]

44 more cases according to CNN.

[Pushka]

2 hours ago, brisalta said:

 

The nice thing about the vacuum toilets on Princess ships is they cannot be flushed with the lid up.

The problem tends to be contamination from peoples unwashed hands.

I don’t like having to lift the lid from when the last person has exited. I can’t see thats hygienic either. Surely with stalls the issue of flushing is pretty much negated?

 

44 more cases according to CNN.

 

Yes, that Info was released a few hours ago and they know about it onboard. 

Edited February 13, 2020 by Pushka

[OzKiwiJJ]

1 hour ago, Aus Traveller said:

I recall that the Japanese Olympic Committee has chartered at least one ship to use for accommodation during the Olympics this year.

Yes, Sun Princess has been booked as Olympic accommodation.

[SunNFunCruzer]

Just now, Pushka said:

I don’t like having to lift the lid from when the last person has exited. I can’t see thats hygienic either. Surely with stalls the issue of flushing is pretty much negated?

 

I always use a tissue or handful of toilet paper to lift the lid.  And to flush. And to open, lock and unlock the door to the stall and the external door.  I also use a clean tissue when I have to touch a banister or any other surface that is used by a lot of other people.  I am not OCD, but people are gross and who wants to be sick while you're traveling or on vacation? 

 

If I am refilling a soda at a soda machine, I either use a napkin or push with my knuckle as opposed to fingertip.  If you ever go to a fast food restaurant, watch how people lick salt, etc, off their finger tips and then go push the button for soda.  The nozzles and machines themselves are not the cleanest, but there's only so many precautions a person can take without taking the enjoyment out of life. 

[mcrcruiser]

1 hour ago, ClearyCreek said:

44 more cases according to CNN.

Are you saying that CNN reported 44 new virus cases on Diamond Princess  ?

 Do you have  a  link ?

 TIA

Edited February 13, 2020 by mcrcruiser

[Aus Traveller]

3 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

Are you saying that CNN reported 44 new virus cases on Diamond Princess  ?

 Do you have  a  link ?

 TIA

I think that is the latest news. The last total I saw was 218 including one crew member.

[SunNFunCruzer]

5 minutes ago, mcrcruiser said:

Are you saying that CNN reported 44 new virus cases on Diamond Princess  ?

 Do you have  a  link ?

 TIA

 

Here's the link.  CNN is calling it 219

 

https://www.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-13-20-intl-hnk/index.html

[mcrcruiser]

15 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

 

Here's the link.  CNN is calling it 219

 

https://www.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-13-20-intl-hnk/index.html

Thanks . My wife is 80 & I am 81 with underlying medical issues & we use medicines to keep it under control  .I can not imagine the strain  on people our age  who have been quarantined on this ship . We understand that the quarantine period is another 7 days  .We pray that those with out signs of  this virus can be released from this ship asap  . May God protect  all the people on Diamond Princess 

[Aus Traveller]

29 minutes ago, SunNFunCruzer said:

 

Here's the link.  CNN is calling it 219

 

https://www.cnn.com/asia/live-news/coronavirus-outbreak-02-13-20-intl-hnk/index.html

My 218 figure is passengers and crew from the ship. There was one Quarantine Officer as well - total 219.

[BrennerM]

A couple of people in Tokyo are now confirmed to have the disease, including a taxi driver.  So Japan may soon have other worries than quarantining one cruise ship.

[auldlassie]

Been saying testing everyone on board was the only way forward for days now. Eventually, the inevitability of this expense finally hits the economic fan.....

Prime Minister Shinzo Abe on Wednesday said that the government will bolster testing capabilities for those on the cruise ship to about 1,000 samples per day by Feb. 18 by allowing testing at private facilities. So far, only up to about 300 samples can be tested each day at public health centers nationwide. Kato said the government is contemplating testing all passengers and crew members.

https://www.japantimes.co.jp/news/2020/02/12/national/science-health/40-new-coronavirus-cases-cruise-ship-quarantined-japan/#.XkQ74RNKjPA

 

Please, no one repeat to me that Japan could not do this earlier  -  Japan is rich, sophisticated, littered with medical testing facilities and well capable of doing so. It was - and is, the world over, - all about the political "cost versus need" decision.

[caribill]

On 2/12/2020 at 11:13 AM, beg3yrs said:

Princess has announced this on their web-site:

• How will you sanitize the ship once the quarantine is lifted and the  guests  have disembarked? 

  A:  Once the quarantine is lifted, the ship will be taken to a special service dock, where it will receive a rigorous Level 3 cleaning and disinfection, like hospital operating rooms, to fully sanitize all stateroom and public venues.

 

And what about sanitizing the personal possessions of those currently on the ship before they bring their luggage home?

[mcfly666]

15 hours ago, Tamerton said:

I think a ship would be easy to fumigate, you could get everyone off, lock it up and us an antiviral agent.

Staff can go in a few days later and wipe the ship clean. Soft furnishings would be taken care of that way.

We're booked for the 15th March and not worried of the disease just worried we may get stuck in quarantine.

I also think the most dangerous place for infection would be the queues before boarding when no one is screened and everyone is in a hurry to get on the ship.

 

I am worry. My parents (80 and 76) are coming with us along with my children on the March 15th sailing. A lot of people already cancelled as I can see the price of a mini suite is more than $1000 cheaper right now than I paid for inside cabin few months ago (And this cruise was sold out earlier). If I can get even 75% Future Ship Credit, I would have cancelled or rescheduled my sailing already.

[bluesea321]

5 minutes ago, mcfly666 said:

I am worry. My parents (80 and 76) are coming with us along with my children on the March 15th sailing. A lot of people already cancelled as I can see the price of a mini suite is more than $1000 cheaper right now than I paid for inside cabin few months ago (And this cruise was sold out earlier). If I can get even 75% Future Ship Credit, I would have cancelled or rescheduled my sailing already.

 

I think your health and that of your family is more important. I am surprised that Princess would not let you switch cruises, ludicrous IMO.

[bluesea321]

15 hours ago, npcl said:

Cruise lines operate on fairly narrow margins, they have lots of debt.  If there is any substantial reduction in the number of cruisers for a year  they will be in trouble.  Keep in mind that even during the recession fares came down, but the ships basically sailed full. You get ships going at 70 or 80 percent of capacity for a year and the cruise lines will pretty much hope for a very large line of credit.  Take a look at the numbers in the 10k and 10q filings for CCL, NCLH and RCL. They pretty much need steady cash flow.

 

Backing up what you said:

 

In Coronavirus, $45-Billion Cruise Industry Faces a Big Challenge

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/02/12/travel/coronavirus-cruises-travel.html?action=click&module=Top Stories&pgtype=Homepage

[cruiserchuck]

15 minutes ago, mcfly666 said:

 

I am worry. My parents (80 and 76) are coming with us along with my children on the March 15th sailing. A lot of people already cancelled as I can see the price of a mini suite is more than $1000 cheaper right now than I paid for inside cabin few months ago (And this cruise was sold out earlier). If I can get even 75% Future Ship Credit, I would have cancelled or rescheduled my sailing already.

 

It seems extremely unlikely the March 15 sailing will take place.  If you can handle the suspense and uncertainty, it might be best to not cancel now, and wait to see if Princess cancels the cruise. 

[kearney]

20 minutes ago, cruiserchuck said:

 

It seems extremely unlikely the March 15 sailing will take place.  If you can handle the suspense and uncertainty, it might be best to not cancel now, and wait to see if Princess cancels the cruise. 

I agree... unless you have to cancel now.....I would wait. We have no idea how long this is going to go on with the existing situation... given how more and more people are getting sick and the fact that is spreads easily.....and can live on surfaces for many days.... I suspect that once ship is cleared of passengers....they may want to let the ship sit empty for a couple of weeks and then do a deep cleaning.....allow most or all the virus to die off before doing deep cleaning.... or the reverse deep clean and then let it sit to allow residual virus to die.... that could delay next sailing into April.....but if this keeps getting worse...there could be impact to flights through out Asia.    But I would watch and wait before canceling 

[TrixieBel]

1 hour ago, mcfly666 said:

My parents (80 and 76) are coming with us along with my children on the March 15th sailing.

If your parents have insurance they may be able to get a doctors letter stating they should not be travelling into Singapore because of the coronavirus and Singapore being at Orange Alert Level. Then they could use that to claim back cancellation fees etc from their insurance company? 
 

Best check with the insurance company first though - pushing the “frail elderly couple” aspect as to why they may need to cancel.

[brisalta]

1 hour ago, mcfly666 said:

 

I am worry. My parents (80 and 76) are coming with us along with my children on the March 15th sailing. A lot of people already cancelled as I can see the price of a mini suite is more than $1000 cheaper right now than I paid for inside cabin few months ago (And this cruise was sold out earlier). If I can get even 75% Future Ship Credit, I would have cancelled or rescheduled my sailing already.

 

So far the following voyages have been cancelled https://www.princess.com/news/notices_and_advisories/notices/itinerary-modifications-cancellations.html

[forbenjoy]

i am just wondering... since passengers were quarantined for 14 days after their exposure to the first case, will passengers who were cabinmates to recently diagnosed cases, be quarantined for 14 days after their most recent exposure? it would make sense to me since they may be harboring virus for the next 14 days. i'd hate to be on a flight with the spouse of someone who was diagnosed a couple of days ago.

[npcl]

1 hour ago, TrixieBel said:

If your parents have insurance they may be able to get a doctors letter stating they should not be travelling into Singapore because of the coronavirus and Singapore being at Orange Alert Level. Then they could use that to claim back cancellation fees etc from their insurance company? 
 

Best check with the insurance company first though - pushing the “frail elderly couple” aspect as to why they may need to cancel.

Considering that they were probably frail and elderly when they booked, not much chance for that.  They would need a change in actual medical condition before being able to be canceled for a covered reason.

[chipmaster]

On 2/11/2020 at 9:50 PM, Kenswing said:

How do you know that he caught it on the ship? Japan has repatriated a lot of citizens from China. Who’s to say he didn’t contact it from one of them?

 

You obviously didn't read the news release, may it was wrong....