Do you REALLY think we'll be cruising this year?

[miched]

I will cruise this year and nothing can change it or stop me because I have already been on 3.  

 

Also plan  on being able to go on the one we have booked in Dec since we booked at a great price but if it doesn’t happen hopefully we will live on to be able to cruise on the next one or do something else.  
 

happy cruising 🌊🚢🇺🇸🌅

[sanger727]

1 hour ago, BigAl94 said:

Masks are not the be all and end all solution to the problem. In fact their misuse by many users actually puts them at increased risk, disposable masks should be properly put on and kept on then disposed of and replaced. Unbelievable the number of people who reuse them, reposition them on their face, lower them to speak, eat etc all dramatically increasing the risk of catching infection from the mask itself. Then there is the issue of insufficient supplies for front line workers if demand is significantly raised by the general public. 

 

The masks that the public are supposed to wear are the homemade/cloth ones, not medical grade. They are meant to protect others from you, not you from others. The re-use, repositioning, lowering, etc are not really an issue when you assume that you are infected and your mask is therefore infected (which is the point of the mask to prevent asymptomatic people from spreading the disease). The main goal would be to contain the viruses particles to you at that point. 

[Happy Cruiser 6143]

4 hours ago, TeeRick said:

We are required to wear masks in the USA to go out to grocery stores for example.  But they are only to protect others from your own respiratory vapors.  Not oneself.  No medical-quality protective masks are available to the general population.  Healthcare workers are also at risk because there are not sufficient protective medical masks like N-95.  Many people have to try and make their own masks of any material at hand.  But most people are trying. Try finding masks at the store or on Amazon.  Good luck with that!  It is hard to comply with proper mask techniques in this situation.  We are told that any covering is better than no covering.  Those are the sad facts here on May 5th over 4 months into the pandemic.

 

You may be required to wear masks in the grocery store in Pennsylvania, but I assure you that is not a requirement for the USA as a whole.  No such requirement here.  Also, please see recent information from Dr. Michael Osterholm, an infectious disease specialist, who states that homemade masks provide no protection against the droplets in the air because they are not airtight.

[Happy Cruiser 6143]

4 hours ago, Charles4515 said:

 

It is the start of the bad news being reported by the cruise lines themselves. They are required by law in SEC reports to report their outlook and worst case scenario. I think most of us except the biggest fans and deniers realized that with no revenue all the cruise lines are in trouble. Also reading the tea leaves NCL does not want to refund money. Wait to the last minute to cancel cruises and get people to take FCC instead of cash. Of course they had no problem issuing Frank Del Rio an $18 million dollar bonus in the last few weeks while laying off shoreside workers.....


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No, this is a routine SEC filing.

[UnorigionalName]

38 minutes ago, Happy Cruiser 6143 said:

 

You may be required to wear masks in the grocery store in Pennsylvania, but I assure you that is not a requirement for the USA as a whole.  No such requirement here.  Also, please see recent information from Dr. Michael Osterholm, an infectious disease specialist, who states that homemade masks provide no protection against the droplets in the air because they are not airtight.

 

Yeah, the data on those homemade masks isn't great, it's a little unknown.  But what you should be taking back from that data, is that everyone needs to be wearing surgical masks or better, not that no masks is fine.  The homemade masks was only supposed to be a stopgap until you can source surgical masks.  There is not a huge shortage of surgical masks, and those are fine for the general population to use.  There is a shortage of N95 and better masks for health care workers.

 

The purpose of the masks at a populational level isn't to be 100% effective at preventing you from getting an infection, it's to prevent a COVID positive person from transmitting the virus to someone else.  I don't wear masks to prevent myself from getting the disease, I wear a mask out of respect of my fellow neighbors, in the hope that they will reciprocate and wear a mask to protect me.  

 

edit: also their conclusion is not that home-made masks are useless.  It's that the benefit of home-made masks is unknown:  "The current level of benefit, if any, is not possible to assess,"

 

All this not wanting to wear a mask isn't rugged individualism.  It's being selfish and only caring about your comfort over the health of your neighbor.

 

Like, who cares if masks aren't perfect.  if 100% of people wore masks (like in taiwan, Japan, and HK), there is evidence that the transmission rates are lower.  Maybe if 100% of people wore masks, we could go back to partial relaxing, and still keep R below 1, so that  that it doesn't blow up.  Everything doesn't have to be 100% effective.  You pile enough effective stuff together to get the R below 1.  Masks are so benign, it's better than killing the economy.   It's like the most benign measure you can have at reducing spread of disease.  Yet people are getting shot over asking people to be polite and have care for their neighbors and wear a mask.  I honestly cannot believe this country.

 

Edit: also, the conclusion from Dr. Michael Osterholm was not that home-made masks are useless, but that:  "The current level of benefit, if any, is not possible to assess,"

Edited May 5, 2020 by UnorigionalName

[zitsky]

R below 1.  Is that infection rate?

[markeb]

R is reproductive number. Less than 1 means no sustained transmission. 
 

measles is 14-18...

[alley24]

If we all wear masks this means the number will get below R1,  we will beat this virus and can get back to cruising

[yorky]

6 minutes ago, alley24 said:

If we all wear masks this means the number will get below R1,  we will beat this virus and can get back to cruising

Opinions from various sources over in the UK are very mixed and at this point the government  is still not convinced if they are honest about it. I’m not sure there are even enough masks available for everyone.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51205344

Edited May 5, 2020 by yorky

[hcat]

Masks not that easy to find here on NY. Found a few good ones and some paper.

 

Finally,  ones we ordered on line are set to arrive this week..Chinese product, huge delays!

[UnorigionalName]

31 minutes ago, yorky said:

Opinions from various sources over in the UK are very mixed and at this point the government  is still not convinced if they are honest about it. I’m not sure there are even enough masks available for everyone.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-51205344

 

Yeah, I don't get why westerners are so against wearing facemasks. Who cares if it ends up not working or only helps a little.

 

What's the cost-benefit?

 

Cost: cheap surgical mask and mild discomfort.

 

Benefit: unknown, but possible preventing infection.

 

Like, what's the downside?  Like what's the point in waiting till people die until evidence is out.  What's the harm in wearing it now to be polite even if it turns out to be useless?  cause you don't like it? how selfish.

[alley24]

Masks my not prevent you from getting it (although it will help)  but even a homemade mask will greatly prevent people from "spreading it".  Of course everyone must wash their hands and keep their distance.  The virus is hard to stop because asymptomatic people spread it.  If everyone gets on the same page we conquer the virus.  Its that simple and also that complicated.

[ECCruise]

2 hours ago, Happy Cruiser 6143 said:

 

No, this is a routine SEC filing.

Ain't nothing routine about an 8k warning about "a substantial doubt about it's ability to continue as a going concern."

[Fouremco]

Even little kids are taught and seem to understand that sneezing into your elbow when you have a cold helps to minimize the droplets spewed into the air that might be breathed in or subsequently touched by other people. Why do so many people seem have trouble with the concept of masks providing the same type of protection, at a much higher level, when asymptomatic carriers wear them. The ongoing resistance to wearing them is truly baffling.

[Cruise a holic]

7 hours ago, RichYak said:

Actually, that's sort of backwards. The longer people do not cooperate, the longer the restrictions will go on. But the pandemic would end sooner if we all went about our regular business, albeit with potentially more dire consequences. The trick is finding the right balance.

Right balance?  As long as people continue to die From covid by the tens of thousands nationwide,  it isn’t safe to open most businesses 

[yorky]

21 minutes ago, Fouremco said:

Even little kids are taught and seem to understand that sneezing into your elbow when you have a cold helps to minimize the droplets spewed into the air that might be breathed in or subsequently touched by other people. Why do so many people seem have trouble with the concept of masks providing the same type of protection, at a much higher level, when asymptomatic carriers wear them. The ongoing resistance to wearing them is truly baffling.

People are led by government advice, as I posted with the BBC link it’s not universally accepted that masks work. It’s not that long ago that people thought it rediculous, people used to laugh at those wearing masks in Asia. The UK government has no plans to provide them and are there even enough available should they chose to do so ? 

Edited May 5, 2020 by yorky

[1SGCruiser]

On 4/21/2020 at 7:32 PM, jonthomas said:

Definitely nothing this year. 

I agree completely.  MAYBE 2021 by mid-year.....

[Pushka]

Except for the medical ones, Face masks are simply like holding up a handkerchief to your face. It will certainly reduce infection from the wearer to other people. Although touching it a lot then that person touching other surfaces that then get touched by others, is a risk. 
 

Masks are not required anywhere in Australia. In some ways I wish they were. Currently, our state has not had any infections for 14 days and only 4 active cases and just 1 in hospital in a general ward. We are starting to return to work. Our borders will be closed for months yet until other countries are deemed safe. Currently the only other safe country with no infections is NZ. 

Edited May 5, 2020 by Pushka

[madmacs]

As said elsewhere the views of experts in the UK are mixed on wearing masks, with the majority view being that they will not reduce infections. I have no inherent objection to wearing one on public transport, but would not be keen on wearing one on a cruise for two weeks, cruises are a discretionary expenditure and would be one thing putting me off cruising.

 

I never thought I would agree with Donald Trump on anything but veer more towards his views on this issue.

[npcl]

1 hour ago, ECCruise said:

Ain't nothing routine about an 8k warning about "a substantial doubt about it's ability to continue as a going concern."

Actually it is fairly routine.  It is a requirement anytime a company determines that it run the risk of running out of liquidity in the next 12 month period and has not stated such in its last filing, even if it has options for improving its liquidity.

 

Many companies have made such disclosures in their history  (for example Tesla Feb 2018).

[ECCruise]

6 minutes ago, npcl said:

Actually it is fairly routine.  It is a requirement anytime a company determines that it run the risk of running out of liquidity in the next 12 month period and has not stated such in its last filing, even if it has options for improving its liquidity.

 

Many companies have made such disclosures in their history  (for example Tesla Feb 2018).

May well be, but I can't find any language even close to that in 2018 SEC filings from Tesla, warning of doubt about the ability to remain a going concern.  That is the disturbing language.  

[RichYak]

1 hour ago, Cruise a holic said:

Right balance?  As long as people continue to die From covid by the tens of thousands nationwide,  it isn’t safe to open most businesses 

Yes, the right balance. I made no claims as to what the right balance is.

[mayleeman]

But we are doing a great job! 

 

Of course, when you have almost 5 times as many cases and over twice as many deaths as any other country, it does make you wonder what a bad job would look like! 

 

I think cruising won't occur in any meaningful sense this year except in countries that really are doing a great job.

[zitsky]

6 minutes ago, mayleeman said:

But we are doing a great job! 

 

Of course, when you have almost 5 times as many cases and over twice as many deaths as any other country, it does make you wonder what a bad job would look like! 

 

I think cruising won't occur in any meaningful sense this year except in countries that really are doing a great job.

 

Viking is doing Mississippi river cruises.  Seems pretty safe to me.  Nice and local.

[Charles4515]

 
Viking is doing Mississippi river cruises.  Seems pretty safe to me.  Nice and local.

Need to verify but it was posted on another thread that those Mississippi River cruises are between $500 and $600 per person a night.


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