Might the new "no quarantine" guidelines be a game changer?

[Markanddonna]

https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/cdc-guidelines-after-vaccine

 

A scenario for November 2021: So, it seems that if you are on a cruise ship and the dreaded news erupts about a case of COVID 10 being diagnosed onboard, passengers who can prove they have been fully vaccinated would not have to quarantine. Everyone else would quarantine. 

 

Does this make the case for the cruise ship lines to require documentation of a recent vaccine?

[Flatbush Flyer]

47 minutes ago, Markanddonna said:

https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/cdc-guidelines-after-vaccine

 

A scenario for November 2021: So, it seems that if you are on a cruise ship and the dreaded news erupts about a case of COVID 10 being diagnosed onboard, passengers who can prove they have been fully vaccinated would not have to quarantine. Everyone else would quarantine. 

 

Does this make the case for the cruise ship lines to require documentation of a recent vaccine?

Don’t need to make a case. It would be idiocy for a cruise line to not require bona fide proof of Covid vaccination (including any required boosters - annual or otherwise), a pre-cruise negative Covid test, an onboard mask/social distance requirement and only ship’s port tours from the restart of cruising (fourth quarter 2021?) through, at least, all of calendar year 2022. Of course, all of this would be in addition to the precautions/restrictions added when concern exists for public health issues like Noro.

[Hlitner]

That sure would help.  But the unanswered question still remains which is whether a person who has been vaccinated can still be a asymptomatic spreader (or superspreader) of COVID.  Until the various authorities can answer that question to the satisfaction of most countries, there still does not seem to be a way forward for cruise ships.    Consider you are a Caribbean Island or country where plenty of your own folks have yet to be vaccinated and you are faced with the decision of whether to allow any cruise ship to dock in your country.  While the economic benefit is nice, there is also the chance that somebody from that ship is going to start a new pandemic event on your island/country.  I cannot imagine most countries allowing ships.  One possible exception is here in Mexico where the President (Obrador)  does not seem to like the idea of lockdowns or most mitigation.  I would not be surprised to see Mexico as the first country to welcome back cruises.

 

Hank

[SelectSys]

5 hours ago, Markanddonna said:

passengers who can prove they have been fully vaccinated would not have to quarantine.

 

The story you post doesn't support this conclusion until the data comes in:

 

"Until we can fully quantify and understand how much the risk is of transmission asymptomatic transmission. That's the key here, asymptomatic vaccination, just because you're asymptomatic doesn't mean that the virus is not still in your nose and you can sneeze and you can cough and you can, while you're talking and spread to someone around you." 

 

For now, it’s a waiting game, but leading health experts say they are optimistic. The CDC says while the vaccines have proven to have high effective rates for preventing severe symptoms of COVID-19, there is still limited information on how well the vaccines might reduce transmission.

 

That’s why they still say people who have been vaccinated will need to continue to wear masks and practice social distancing. 

[cruisingguy007]

Absolutely!!! The 200 million additional doses of vaccine will as well! Yes, time to get excited! This is the best news we've had in a while. There is also a lot of federal covid vaccine sites arriving to states to help bolster state resources. Just need the approval for kids as well and hopefully by the end of summer the worst of this is behind us and things can start normalizing. Great news today! 

[Mary229]

It certainly would give customers confidence.   The quarantine or the abortion of the sailing  has been my biggest personal peeve.   The false positive rate is incredibly high for Coronavirus 

Edited February 12, 2021 by Mary229

[SelectSys]

1 hour ago, cruisingguy007 said:

Absolutely!!! The 200 million additional doses of vaccine will as well! Yes, time to get excited! This is the best news we've had in a while. There is also a lot of federal covid vaccine sites arriving to states to help bolster state resources. Just need the approval for kids as well and hopefully by the end of summer the worst of this is behind us and things can start normalizing. Great news today! 

 

Certainly this will likely help The federal sites are less important that the doses.  I understand many sites are already running at reduced capacity.  Dodger Stadium for example shutdown for a while.  I am watching for signs that supply is really going up as that will drive progress rather than announcements.

 

The other thing is that we don't know the extent to which things are really working.  I am sure many informed eyes are watching what happens in Israel as they have far and away vaccinated more people. Look there if you want to see what happens next in terms of cases.

https://ourworldindata.org/vaccination-israel-impact

 

Finally, as has been stated repeatedly, your vaccination does not necessarily result in entry to a country without widescale vaccination in place. 

Edited February 12, 2021 by SelectSys

[pris993]

25 minutes ago, SelectSys said:

 

Certainly this will likely help The federal sites are less important that the doses.  I understand many sites are already running at reduced capacity.  Dodger Stadium for example shutdown for a while.  I am watching for signs that supply is really going up as that will drive progress rather than announcements.

 

The other thing is that we don't know the extent to which things are really working.  I am sure many informed eyes are watching what happens in Israel as they have far and away vaccinated more people. Look there if you want to see what happens next in terms of cases.

https://ourworldindata.org/vaccination-israel-impact

 

Finally, as has been stated repeatedly, your vaccination does not necessarily result in entry to a country without widescale vaccination in place. 

Interesting you mention Israel.  I am looking to fly there,  presently Israel is not open to anyone with a foreign passport unless they have direct family connections.  So watching what Israel does once they have vaccinated their entire population is a good.  

[SelectSys]

14 hours ago, pris993 said:

Interesting you mention Israel.  I am looking to fly there,  presently Israel is not open to anyone with a foreign passport unless they have direct family connections.  So watching what Israel does once they have vaccinated their entire population is a good.  

 

I am not surprised that the Israeli borders are going to remain largely closed for general non-essential travel.  I wonder if those coming under the "Law of Return" are also permitted even if they don't have a family connection?

 

The good new is that the Israeli's are sharing their data with Pfizer at a minimum.  I am sure the world's medical community and policy makers will be watching the next 6 months extremely closely!  Maybe cruise line executives are also looking for clues as well.

 

https://www.usnews.com/news/best-countries/articles/2021-01-21/israeli-government-sharing-covid-19-vaccine-data-with-pfizer

 

 

[Markanddonna]

So glad that a first world country with success and some integrity is giving the world access to their test data. 

[njhorseman]

On 2/11/2021 at 8:35 AM, Markanddonna said:

https://www.fox35orlando.com/news/cdc-guidelines-after-vaccine

 

A scenario for November 2021: So, it seems that if you are on a cruise ship and the dreaded news erupts about a case of COVID 10 being diagnosed onboard, passengers who can prove they have been fully vaccinated would not have to quarantine. Everyone else would quarantine. 

 

Does this make the case for the cruise ship lines to require documentation of a recent vaccine?

One problem. The CDC guidance on vaccinated persons not needing to quarantine after exposure to COVID expires three months after vaccination. Many of us, particularly senior citizens, have already been vaccinated or will be in the very near future. By the cruising restarts the 3 month window will have already passed for many cruisers.

[sverigecruiser]

Lots of people in Israel are vaccinated but that doesn't seen to slow down the infection.

 

Is that worrying or is it just too early to see the effect? I don't know.

[njhorseman]

4 hours ago, sverigecruiser said:

Lots of people in Israel are vaccinated but that doesn't seen to slow down the infection.

 

Is that worrying or is it just too early to see the effect? I don't know.

From what I've read the problem arose for a couple of reasons, including failure to distribute the vaccine to the Palestinian population initially and COVID lock down weariness in the population causing a failure to obey protocols. Also here in the US  the ultra Orthodox population has a substantial opposition to vaccination and I think the same is true in Israel. 

The most recent data I've seen look like they've starting to turn the corner and the infection rate is slowing.

Edited February 13, 2021 by njhorseman

[BoozinCroozin]

Anyone 18 and older should be required to be vaccinated to cruise. Those under 18 will not because a vaccine does not exist. My feeling now is that vaccines are a requirement to cruise for anyone that is eligible to have it. Cruising is a choice and vaccinations are a choice. Choose wisely.

[antmaril]

On 2/12/2021 at 1:59 PM, njhorseman said:

One problem. The CDC guidance on vaccinated persons not needing to quarantine after exposure to COVID expires three months after vaccination. Many of us, particularly senior citizens, have already been vaccinated or will be in the very near future. By the cruising restarts the 3 month window will have already passed for many cruisers.

Yes.  This is the kicker.  Ugh.  Hopefully, as they learn more, they will extend this recommendation to longer than three months post full vaccination.  
 

When I first read this the other day, I had to read it three times.  It is very discouraging.  But, I guess at this point, they just don’t know.  

Edited February 14, 2021 by antmaril

[Hlitner]

1 hour ago, antmaril said:

Yes.  This is the kicker.  Ugh.  Hopefully, as they learn more, they will extend this recommendation to longer than three months post full vaccination.  
 

When I first read this the other day, I had to read it three times.  It is very discouraging.  But, I guess at this point, they just don’t know.  

We agree and think that the CDC issued the interim (3 month) decision pending the release of new data on the potential of asymmetric spread from vaccinated persons.

 

Hank 

[ldubs]

7 hours ago, BoozinCroozin said:

Anyone 18 and older should be required to be vaccinated to cruise. Those under 18 will not because a vaccine does not exist. My feeling now is that vaccines are a requirement to cruise for anyone that is eligible to have it. Cruising is a choice and vaccinations are a choice. Choose wisely.

 

'Those under 18 will not because a vaccine does not exist." 

 

You mean the vaccine has yet to be released for that age group (though I think it is under 16).  I thought the reason under 16 were excluded from the current vaccine was because they were not included in the trials.    

 

Maybe I'm reading too literally.  

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, ldubs said:

 

'Those under 18 will not because a vaccine does not exist." 

 

You mean the vaccine has yet to be released for that age group (though I think it is under 16).  I thought the reason under 16 were excluded from the current vaccine was because they were not included in the trials.    

 

Maybe I'm reading too literally.  

I have read that the Moderna vaccine is presently for 18 and over while the Pfizer is for 16 and over. That is why you see both numbers cited. I think there are also test trials now being done for younger people.

[cruisingguy007]

1 hour ago, ontheweb said:

I have read that the Moderna vaccine is presently for 18 and over while the Pfizer is for 16 and over. That is why you see both numbers cited. I think there are also test trials now being done for younger people.

 

This is correct. They will do 12-15 first, 9-12 next, and then 6-9 last. It is done this way as a precaution in the USA. There are no plans as of yet for under 6 years of age.   

[Roger88]

3 hours ago, ldubs said:

 

'Those under 18 will not because a vaccine does not exist." 

 

You mean the vaccine has yet to be released for that age group (though I think it is under 16).  I thought the reason under 16 were excluded from the current vaccine was because they were not included in the trials.    

 

Maybe I'm reading too literally.  

My sister has three children under 18 years of age. All of them were infected. Only the little one almost had no signs of it, while the other two suffered just like everyone else.  But again, I havent heard of underage people getting vaccines for some reason .. 

[cruisingguy007]

1 minute ago, Roger88 said:

My sister has three children under 18 years of age. All of them were infected. Only the little one almost had no signs of it, while the other two suffered just like everyone else.  But again, I havent heard of underage people getting vaccines for some reason .. 

 

The first trial group is now full with participants and is underway. The next two phases will start sequentially once enough time passes in the previous groups to demonstrate no adverse side effects. All three should be completed by the end of summer and theoretically, those 6 and up vaccinated as well, hopefully in time for the next school year. I predict it will go very well since there haven't been any reported problems in trials in children in other countries and those were started/completed long ago. If they can keep up with manufacturing, things should be looking up come the end of summer.

[ontheweb]

49 minutes ago, cruisingguy007 said:

 

The first trial group is now full with participants and is underway. The next two phases will start sequentially once enough time passes in the previous groups to demonstrate no adverse side effects. All three should be completed by the end of summer and theoretically, those 6 and up vaccinated as well, hopefully in time for the next school year. I predict it will go very well since there haven't been any reported problems in trials in children in other countries and those were started/completed long ago. If they can keep up with manufacturing, things should be looking up come the end of summer.

Oxford-AstraZeneca begins a vaccine trial for children. It’s the youngest group yet to be tested. (msn.com)

 

This article predicts that a vaccine for children will probably not be ready until the next calendar year.

[sanger727]

As of right now the CDC doesn’t recommend quarantining within 3 months of recovering from Covid or 3 months of receiving vaccine. Not much of a game changer. Maybe it will lengthen in the future but that’s too small a window to make much of a difference. 

[ldubs]

20 hours ago, Roger88 said:

My sister has three children under 18 years of age. All of them were infected. Only the little one almost had no signs of it, while the other two suffered just like everyone else.  But again, I havent heard of underage people getting vaccines for some reason .. 

 

Oh boy, I'm sure that was tough on the family (and kids).  God, I hate this pandemic.