vaccine required?

[pms4104]

2 minutes ago, richsea said:

But most of the crew generally come from less wealthy nations.

True ... crew vax not the same as a nation deciding how it believes its population needs to be prioitized for vaccines 

[Steelers36]

2 hours ago, richsea said:

But most of the crew generally come from less wealthy nations.

Yes, so if USA actually did vaccinate hundreds of foreign cruise ship staff, they could reduce the donations to those countries appropriately and you still have the end result of providing X vaccinations to less wealthy countries.  

[kiwimum]

2 hours ago, Steelers36 said:

Yes, so if USA actually did vaccinate hundreds of foreign cruise ship staff, they could reduce the donations to those countries appropriately and you still have the end result of providing X vaccinations to less wealthy countries.  

Or they could allow the cruise industry to buy from the 30 million doses of AstraZeneca the US has stockpiled.   

[Daniel A]

1 hour ago, kiwimum said:

Or they could allow the cruise industry to buy from the 30 million doses of AstraZeneca the US has stockpiled.   

The only problem right now with that option is that the AstraZeneca vaccine is not authorized for use in the United States, so CDC is not likely to recognize that the AZ vaccinated crew as being fully vaccinated.  (That may end up being changed if/when AZ gets an EUA.)

[kiwimum]

5 minutes ago, Daniel A said:

The only problem right now with that option is that the AstraZeneca vaccine is not authorized for use in the United States, so CDC is not likely to recognize that the AZ vaccinated crew as being fully vaccinated.  (That may end up being changed if/when AZ gets an EUA.)

AstraZeneca has been approved by the WHO and is in use in many countries.   I am in the US trial, fully vaccinated and have been reassured I meet the requirements.   What are they going to do with the European and Asian crew that have received AstraZeneca in their home countries.  The US cannot discriminate on what type of vaccine you have had.  

[nocl]

9 hours ago, Daniel A said:

If, only we could believe that to be the case.  I have zero confidence that the CDC/HHS would prioritize foreign cruise ship personnel before deciding on other more politically correct and connected priorities.  (Such as handing it all over to the WHO or Doctors Without Borders.)  Past practices do not support the US Government doing much at all to assist the cruise industry.

 

Before I get flamed here, I am not saying that making other priorities as outlined above is a bad thing, I just don't see cruise lines being in line to get surplus vaccines.

I do not expect the CDC or the government to prioritize vaccination for the cruise lines, only that the vaccines should be available for the cruise lines to be able to make arrangements for and obtain the vaccine for crew members.

 

They can probably include in their port agreements🤣

Edited April 18, 2021 by nocl

[ontheweb]

1 hour ago, kiwimum said:

AstraZeneca has been approved by the WHO and is in use in many countries.   I am in the US trial, fully vaccinated and have been reassured I meet the requirements.   What are they going to do with the European and Asian crew that have received AstraZeneca in their home countries.  The US cannot discriminate on what type of vaccine you have had.  

The US could probably discriminate if for instance you took the Chinese vaccine that has no approval. But, since AstraZeneca is approved by the WHO, neither you or crew members would have a problem with it not being recognized as an approved vaccine.

[nocl]

3 hours ago, Daniel A said:

The only problem right now with that option is that the AstraZeneca vaccine is not authorized for use in the United States, so CDC is not likely to recognize that the AZ vaccinated crew as being fully vaccinated.  (That may end up being changed if/when AZ gets an EUA.)

Actually since the AZ vaccine is approve by WHO it is recognized by the US and the CDC.  I doubt the AZ vaccine will get an EUA.  For that matter I doubt AZ will apply for one (they originally said that they would apply in late March or early April).  Better to not apply than to get rejected.

[Redwing55]

11 hours ago, pms4104 said:

And American taxpayers are to foot the bill to vaccinate foreign nationals employed by corporations that incorporate in foreign countries to avoid American taxes and labor laws??? 

As for this foreign incorporation thing.  If that is an issue for people, why do they cruise?  It's a business, it's legal.  Maybe the US needs to change some policies to make it more friendly for them to incorporate in the US?  Oh, and might some be owning any cruise line stock?   So can we leave this foreign incorporation thing off the discussion?  

 

Edited April 19, 2021 by Redwing55

[caribill]

15 hours ago, lolane1 said:

Well Princess, 
I will vote with my dollars.  Until the virus is no longer a threat, I will pick my second favorite line to sail  CELEBRITY who will be requiring passengers and crew to be vaccinated except for children who will require a negative test.

 

 Here is a long list of Cruise lines that will be requiring proof of vaccination. 

https://www.travelagewest.com/Travel/Cruise/Cruise-Lines-COVID-Vaccinations-Requirement

 

 

 

But I have not seen any plan for any of those cruise lines on how their crews will be able to get vaccinated before arriving at a ship.

[Daniel A]

9 hours ago, nocl said:

Actually since the AZ vaccine is approve by WHO it is recognized by the US and the CDC.  I doubt the AZ vaccine will get an EUA.  For that matter I doubt AZ will apply for one (they originally said that they would apply in late March or early April).  Better to not apply than to get rejected.

Do you think if there is a vaccine that has not been authorized for use in the US, that the US Government would sell that vaccine to corporations so they can transport US Citizens on the high seas?  I can see the US permitting foreign governments being able to purchase the vaccines, but I don't see the US selling an unapproved vaccine to private entities.

 

I don't think that approval or EUA from the WHO overrides or circumvents a lack of FDA authorization for distribution in the US - either in bulk or individually.

 

That is the point of my prior post.

[nocl]

2 hours ago, Daniel A said:

Do you think if there is a vaccine that has not been authorized for use in the US, that the US Government would sell that vaccine to corporations so they can transport US Citizens on the high seas?  I can see the US permitting foreign governments being able to purchase the vaccines, but I don't see the US selling an unapproved vaccine to private entities.

 

I don't think that approval or EUA from the WHO overrides or circumvents a lack of FDA authorization for distribution in the US - either in bulk or individually.

 

That is the point of my prior post.

I never said that the US would allow AZ to be used inside the US. Only that the US would accept the vaccinated status of those vaccinated with AZ in trials or in other countries. 

 

Unlike the Sinovac vaccines which is not approved by either WHO or the US.

[ontheweb]

3 hours ago, Daniel A said:

Do you think if there is a vaccine that has not been authorized for use in the US, that the US Government would sell that vaccine to corporations so they can transport US Citizens on the high seas?  I can see the US permitting foreign governments being able to purchase the vaccines, but I don't see the US selling an unapproved vaccine to private entities.

 

I don't think that approval or EUA from the WHO overrides or circumvents a lack of FDA authorization for distribution in the US - either in bulk or individually.

 

That is the point of my prior post.

The USA does have many, many doses of the AstraZeneca vaccine. There seems to be a growing likelihood that AstraZeneca may not even ask for the emergency approval. The vaccines have expiration dates.

 

So, given these facts, what should the US government do? They could just throw them out, which seems a wasteful thing to do. Or they could give them away to other countries that have approved that vaccination, which is what I think they are most likely to do. Or, as an alternative, they could recover some taxpayer money by selling them in the open market.

[Daniel A]

40 minutes ago, nocl said:

I never said that the US would allow AZ to be used inside the US.

I never meant to imply that.  I was making the point that I don't think the government can offer or permit the sale an unauthorized vaccine in the US.  Therefore, I don't think the government could sell it's stockpile of AZ to private companies, but they could sell the stockpiles to other governments outside the US.

[USCcruisecrazy]

On 4/17/2021 at 2:45 PM, ebeluga said:

Well, if after vaccination and with plentiful of access to vaccine, COVID doesn’t kill or hospitalize people any more so than flu or any upper respiratory diseases, and if the ships are operating in US water, itineraries are not disrupted by upper respiratory diseases outbreaks on ships, so why should they be interrupted by COVID?

That's a great question.  I'd be interested to know the answer.  My take would be "It shouldn't be handled any differently".  

[Daniel A]

On 4/17/2021 at 2:45 PM, ebeluga said:

Well, if after vaccination and with plentiful of access to vaccine, COVID doesn’t kill or hospitalize people any more so than flu or any upper respiratory diseases, and if the ships are operating in US water, itineraries are not disrupted by upper respiratory diseases outbreaks on ships, so why should they be interrupted by COVID?

 

27 minutes ago, USCcruisecrazy said:

That's a great question.  I'd be interested to know the answer.  My take would be "It shouldn't be handled any differently".  

Given the conditions @ebeluga put forth, I would think the Secretary of Health and Human Services' declaration of a public health emergency would have been rescinded thus removing the CDC's CSO restrictions. 

Edited April 19, 2021 by Daniel A

[BarbinMich]

On 4/18/2021 at 9:57 AM, lolane1 said:

Well Princess, 
I will vote with my dollars.  Until the virus is no longer a threat, I will pick my second favorite line to sail  CELEBRITY who will be requiring passengers and crew to be vaccinated except for children who will require a negative test.

 

 Here is a long list of Cruise lines that will be requiring proof of vaccination. 

https://www.travelagewest.com/Travel/Cruise/Cruise-Lines-COVID-Vaccinations-Requirement

 

 

I believe all those cruise lines mentioned have relatively small ships which makes social distancing quite difficult if not impossible.  We went on a Viking cruise some years ago and while I very much enjoyed it, I wouldn't do another one at this time.

[Daniel A]

17 minutes ago, BarbinMich said:

I believe all those cruise lines mentioned have relatively small ships which makes social distancing quite difficult if not impossible.  We went on a Viking cruise some years ago and while I very much enjoyed it, I wouldn't do another one at this time.

Very much not the case at all.  Princess, Cunard, Virgin, Viking Ocean and P&O are all mega ships with PAX capacities in the thousands.  

Edited April 19, 2021 by Daniel A

[ALWAYS CRUZIN]

9 minutes ago, BarbinMich said:

I believe all those cruise lines mentioned have relatively small ships which makes social distancing quite difficult if not impossible.  We went on a Viking cruise some years ago and while I very much enjoyed it, I wouldn't do another one at this time.

No matter the size of the ship. Booking 50-60% capacity. I see no problem with distancing. I have read where the seating arrangements for the shows will be easy. Only so many allowed in for each show and seating will be controlled. Dining is no problem. The casino. You will be asked to keep at least one slot machine away from the next player. I am sure it will be monitored. As for the table games. I have no idea. Walking around the ship should not be a problem. We never walk with anyone else. Pool area will be monitored.

[Pamster]

On 4/18/2021 at 1:45 AM, wowzz said:

Temperature checks, at least in the UK,, have been widely discredited. The "gun" type thermometers are wildly inaccurate ( better described as random number generators) and a high temperature in itself is not an indicator of CV19, or indeed any febrile infection.

 

I know of one person who tested positive, and while ill with COVID (he was not asymptomatic) never had an elevated temp.  I'm sure that there are more.

[Roberto256]

On 4/18/2021 at 4:45 AM, wowzz said:

Temperature checks, at least in the UK,, have been widely discredited. The "gun" type thermometers are wildly inaccurate ( better described as random number generators) and a high temperature in itself is not an indicator of CV19, or indeed any febrile infection.

The 'gun' thermometers also have to be calibrated periodically.

 

I think the goal of using them is to make everyone feel good that something is being done to keep them safe,

and to provide a (really tiny) deterrent to someone with symptoms.

 

Better to just hire a bunch of moms to put their hand on folks foreheads as they pass by...

 

[D C]

32 minutes ago, Roberto256 said:

The 'gun' thermometers also have to be calibrated periodically.

 

I think the goal of using them is to make everyone feel good that something is being done to keep them safe,

and to provide a (really tiny) deterrent to someone with symptoms.

 

Better to just hire a bunch of moms to put their hand on folks foreheads as they pass by...

 

 

"Well isn't that nice... a bit odd I suppose as well... a little old lady gave me a kiss on the forehead as I came in the door"

 

"That's just our COVID check station.  "

 

[ontheweb]

54 minutes ago, Roberto256 said:

 

 

Better to just hire a bunch of moms to put their hand on folks foreheads as they pass by...

 

 

The HA HA I gave you was just for this last sentence.

 

As for the rest of your post, I agree it just theater. 

[PescadoAmarillo]

8 hours ago, ALWAYS CRUZIN said:

No matter the size of the ship. Booking 50-60% capacity. I see no problem with distancing. I have read where the seating arrangements for the shows will be easy. Only so many allowed in for each show and seating will be controlled. Dining is no problem. The casino. You will be asked to keep at least one slot machine away from the next player. I am sure it will be monitored. As for the table games. I have no idea. Walking around the ship should not be a problem. We never walk with anyone else. Pool area will be monitored.

Elevators?  Water shuttles? And how is dining no trouble?  Are they going to replace all the 6- and 8-tops with 2- and 4-tops?  What about the pedestals which might not be movable? 50-60% capacity means that everyone should be able to see the shows if all the seats can be filled, but not if there will be any blocked seats. 

[caribill]

14 hours ago, Daniel A said:

Very much not the case at all.  Princess, Cunard, Virgin, Viking Ocean and P&O are all mega ships with PAX capacities in the thousands.  

 

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