Changes Announced for Captain's Club Member Benefits

[weregoingcruising]

4 minutes ago, weregoingcruising said:

Relax it was only a question I said it being a factor.

Correction I never said it was a factor.

[LGW59]

2 hours ago, ECCruise said:

Why is that even a factor?

Obviously, people who have sailed 50, 60, or 85 times like us do not feel the need to feed the kitty with unwanted additional photos, unsatisfying shore excursions, etc.

But, OTOH, we have put well over a $ Hundred Thousand into the kitty for fares.  Be tough to overcome that with photos or excursion profit.

Why do you keep telling us how much money you have spent and contributed to the kitty?  Do what I do, book a suite, it's all included.

[ECCruise]

6 minutes ago, LGW59 said:

Why do you keep telling us how much money you have spent and contributed to the kitty?  Do what I do, book a suite, it's all included.

That was spent for fares.  Which is exactly what I posted and you generously quoted.

Most of it for suites, but likely at considerably less prices than most people are spending (we average around $450 per day, total for 2 for suite fares). 

[jagoffee]

2 hours ago, jg51 said:

.

No, "emmamiller," we will not get ANY minutes of free basic Internet.  Instead, we will get unlimited Internet, but we will have to pay the price for it, which will be "built into" the cruise fare.  That full price will NOT be lowered (by any amount or percentage) to compensate us for the lost 240 minutes, which we had EARNED by our loyalty.  That is one of the two ways in which we are being cheated.  (The other, similar cheating has to do with beverages.)

.

.

You could NOT be more wrong, "Bruin Steve"!

 

You wrote, "It's nice to get these perks."

You are dead wrong to use the word, "perks."  We are not talking about "perks," which is a term that is used to refer to options that have always been offered even to people who have NEVER cruised with Celebrity!

 

Instead, the things that "emmamiller" and I are talking about -- beverages and Internet minutes -- are PROMISED REWARDS (referred to as "BENEFITS") -- that is, goods and services that were EARNED by us loyal, long-time passengers, but are now suddenly and unjustly being denied!   You need to analyze these things carefully and logically to come to the right conclusions ... and you need to "walk a mile in someone else's shoes" for a change.  You need to think of the JUSTICE -- the fair treatment that is due to emmamiller and many thousands of others.

jg51,  

You know that Celebrity has decided to increase the always included value on every cruise by implemented an Always Included approach.  It is obvious that you do not appreciate this new value proposition.  IMO the market will determine how much people are willing to pay for this value.  
Celebrity  is not forcing you to “buy” an internet package, “buy” a Classic drink package, or pay a service/gratuity charge.  As long as you look at it this way, you are destined to be disappointed.  Perhaps you should wait a while until this artificial demand goes away (from the shut down and all the FCC’s).  Celebrity is positioning itself in a unique position.  It will not be all inclusive, but will expand what is included.  For those of us that value the Always Included items, it potentially will be a great change.  
 

My wife and I have been at the Elite Plus level since it’s creation.  Except for the free laundry and the discount for unlimited internet minutes, we have not found a lot of value in the CC benefits. We love Celebrity, but we also cruise other cruise lines.  We would be Zenith if all our cruises had been on Celebrity, but we are not at all disappointed.  We have enjoyed numerous other cruise lines with very nice itineraries.  We would never trade our many cruises in the French Polynesia on smaller ships for a Zenith level.

 

The current situation is causing Celebrity to lose 100’s of million of dollars.  COVID will necessitate the elimination of large group settings for some time. 
 

You can always book the cruises available at the 90 day mark without the Always Included items and use the Captain Club drinks, 250 minute basic internet, and pay or not pay your gratuities/service charge. Certainly this is an economical choice for the lowest costs.  Or do what I do and always evaluate all cruising options, while making the best choice for you.

 

Good  luck getting back to your happy place.  Hopefully some time next year, we can all start traveling again.

 

If I was a Solo traveler, I would not be cruises with Celebrity under this new approach.
 

[Fouremco]

2 minutes ago, jagoffee said:

You can always book the cruises available at the 90 day mark without the Always Included items

Bookings without AI made after the 90 day mark are only available for select sailings.

[LGW59]

4 hours ago, jg51 said:

.

No, "emmamiller," we will not get ANY minutes of free basic Internet.  Instead, we will get unlimited Internet, but we will have to pay the price for it, which will be "built into" the cruise fare.  That full price will NOT be lowered (by any amount or percentage) to compensate us for the lost 240 minutes, which we had EARNED by our loyalty.  That is one of the two ways in which we are being cheated.  (The other, similar cheating has to do with beverages.)

.

.

You could NOT be more wrong, "Bruin Steve"!

 

You wrote, "It's nice to get these perks."

You are dead wrong to use the word, "perks."  We are not talking about "perks," which is a term that is used to refer to options that have always been offered even to people who have NEVER cruised with Celebrity!

 

Instead, the things that "emmamiller" and I are talking about -- beverages and Internet minutes -- are PROMISED REWARDS (referred to as "BENEFITS") -- that is, goods and services that were EARNED by us loyal, long-time passengers, but are now suddenly and unjustly being denied!   You need to analyze these things carefully and logically to come to the right conclusions ... and you need to "walk a mile in someone else's shoes" for a change.  You need to think of the JUSTICE -- the fair treatment that is due to emmamiller and many thousands of others.

"You need to analyze these things carefully and logically to come to the right conclusions"  i.e to agree with my conclusions.

[basenji56]

It looks like the classic drink package is around $59 per person per day on the 7 day cruises I looked up.  (not sure if the 18% tip is added to that amount).

 

Over $800 for the week.

 

Adding that amount into the cruise fare is definitely an annoyance to those of us who don't drink alcohol.  I do drink specialty coffees so it is a little less of a hit, but still, I would prefer to pay for those coffees out of pocket. (In the past, I would drink free specialty coffees at the Elite breakfast.  I would pick up a few free sodas at the Elite cocktail party in the afternoon).

 

I looked up the wifi packages.  The surf package is around $240 for a week for two.  With my elite discount, it would cost around $170.  (I do usually pay for the surf package).  If I didn't use the wifi, having to pay for that $240 would be an annoyance too.

 

If you are personally ok with an increased price of $1000 per week to include those two things, that's fine.  Most of the people who are dismissing the concerns already do pay for those things so it doesn't effect them.

 

But, try to see this from the point of view of people who don't use them and are seeing their cruise price increased around $150 a day. We are not just being whiners.  $150 per day is the price of a nice hotel room on the land.

 

[emmamiller]

1 hour ago, TeaBag said:

The way I read it, Emma, is why would you need your 240 minutes of free internet (which we loved) when you're already paying for it with the AI?

I would have no problem if Celebrity gave another option, cruise only, alongside AI. I don't want to wait for this till 90 days before sailing when all the good cabins are gone.

 

 

Got it!

 

Our only and last Celeb cruise is in Aug 2021, probably will be cancelled but if not, it was booked  before AI so yes Elite Plus perk for internet still stands. 

After AI no longer interests me as there will be NO after for us with Celeb. 

 

 

[ChucktownSteve]

3 hours ago, ECCruise said:

Thank you, Barrister. 🙂

What a  word salad saying the obvious.  And if I have to approach my travel with a constant eye to legalese, than I will find a different way to occupy my time.

 

Celebrity asked for my loyalty.  I gave it to them.  With a thousand cuts over the last 5 or 6 years, they have devalued that loyalty.  C'est la vie.  Not gonna worry about it.  Really.

 

He's used to getting paid by the word. 😁

 

When I'm looking to book a cruise, I consider a few lines and what bang I'm going to get for my buck (not necessarily the cheapest.)  As other lines devalue their loyalty, that will be taken into consideration as I make my decision at the time.

 

I'm not going to worry about the contracts because everyone writes it to favor their cruise line. Therefore I suspect they're probably all equal that way.  However I'm sure someone who has read all of them will correct me. 👀

[TeaBag]

1 hour ago, emmamiller said:

 

Got it!

 

Our only and last Celeb cruise is in Aug 2021, probably will be cancelled but if not, it was booked  before AI so yes Elite Plus perk for internet still stands. 

After AI no longer interests me as there will be NO after for us with Celeb. 

 

 

I was hoping your Aug 21 cruise would be the same one we are on but alas it is not.  We are on Silhouette Norwegian Fjords and the following one, Ireland and Iceland.  I hope these sail also .  Even if they do sail, if the shore excursions are to be ship sponsored only, this will be a deal breaker for us.  I want to visit my relatives.

[Bruin Steve]

There are cruise lines where everything is "all included"...and others where everything is ala carte.  All inclusive tends to be more expensive.  Someone once told me thy loved a particular luxury line because "they don't nickel and dime you for the drinks and other stuff"...and I responded, of course they include that stuff--because they are charging you six times the price...

 

For years, I've read posts here from my friends from the UK complaining about how they don't like being required to pay gratuities...because back home, they don't.  I've always explained that it's a different system...back home, the service is included as it's been blended into the price and the servers are paid accordingly.  Someone always comes back with "Then they should just blend it into the price on the cruise ship as well, pay their help accordingly and not make us have to add to our bill".

 

I've also heard people complain that they shouldn't have to pay tips to the dining room staff because they "always only eat in the buffet".  And some people complain that they hate to be "nickeled and dimed" for everything.  Always a lot of folks calling for things to be all inclusive.

 

Well, the cruise line has a choice--they can keep everything a la carte--as they used to...they can go to all-inclusive--as seems to be the future...or, I guess, they can keep offering packages and have complicated pricing.

 

Including drinks--even in a special fare deal--has always been tricky.  The value of a drink package really isn't anywhere close to $70 a day or whatever they charge.  That assumes everyone has 6-7 drinks per day...which only a few do.  Some don't really drink at all (some are underage), many are drinking lightweights and will never average 7 drinks a day.  Even offering it cheaper, as part of a "deal", is still  winner...because the real cost of those drinks to the cruise line is something less than 50 cents a drink, depending on the drink.  So, any time they can sell you a package...or even include it and add to the price of the cruise, thy are guaranteed profit.  Adding the gratuities is a winner--because they don't have to worry about some people stiffing the crew.  Internet is a no brainer.  They supply it and there is no added cost for extra use.

 

So, when it comes down to it, it's a no briner for the cruise line to go to All Inclusive--it's like pre-selling all of what used to be optional, in advance, to every cruiser.  And "I don't drink" means little--in their eyes, that's YOUR problem...There are probably lots of things onboard that many cruisers don't avail themselves of--and pay for those things anyway because the expense to the cruise line is already blended into the fares.

 

To the cruise line, if they fill up the ships, none of it will matter.  If they see sales decrease in any substantial way, perhaps they re-think it (why they left themselves the option of offering SOME no frills fares).  Now I am sure a lot of people think, "Well, of course we'll all start boycotting and their sales will go down and they will capitulate", however, there's a good chance there are a lot of folks who really don't compare prices that much...and just like the idea of everything being included.  For years I've been making the argument that the drink package, at the full price, is a BAD deal...that it's 6-7 drinks just to break even and you might as well just run the tab since you'll probably pay less.  And the answers always come back with "I don't care.  I just like not having to worry about what I'm spending every time I order a drink".  It's not really logical, but a whole lot of people like the idea.  Those people will also love the idea of All-Inclusive.

[CHEZMARYLOU]

Time for me to move on. Changes to the CC benefits have no impact since we book suites and have for quite a while now. Hope we all get to cruise soon.

[Bruin Steve]

12 minutes ago, TeaBag said:

... if the shore excursions are to be ship sponsored only, this will be a deal breaker for us.  I want to visit my relatives.

I am guessing that when a vaccine is in universal distribution, any of this "shorex only" talk will be gone.  That issue is only because people are looking for how to resume cruising while the pandemic is still running rampant.

[LGW59]

1 hour ago, Bruin Steve said:

There are cruise lines where everything is "all included"...and others where everything is ala carte.  All inclusive tends to be more expensive.  Someone once told me thy loved a particular luxury line because "they don't nickel and dime you for the drinks and other stuff"...and I responded, of course they include that stuff--because they are charging you six times the price...

 

For years, I've read posts here from my friends from the UK complaining about how they don't like being required to pay gratuities...because back home, they don't.  I've always explained that it's a different system...back home, the service is included as it's been blended into the price and the servers are paid accordingly.  Someone always comes back with "Then they should just blend it into the price on the cruise ship as well, pay their help accordingly and not make us have to add to our bill".

 

I've also heard people complain that they shouldn't have to pay tips to the dining room staff because they "always only eat in the buffet".  And some people complain that they hate to be "nickeled and dimed" for everything.  Always a lot of folks calling for things to be all inclusive.

 

Well, the cruise line has a choice--they can keep everything a la carte--as they used to...they can go to all-inclusive--as seems to be the future...or, I guess, they can keep offering packages and have complicated pricing.

 

Including drinks--even in a special fare deal--has always been tricky.  The value of a drink package really isn't anywhere close to $70 a day or whatever they charge.  That assumes everyone has 6-7 drinks per day...which only a few do.  Some don't really drink at all (some are underage), many are drinking lightweights and will never average 7 drinks a day.  Even offering it cheaper, as part of a "deal", is still  winner...because the real cost of those drinks to the cruise line is something less than 50 cents a drink, depending on the drink.  So, any time they can sell you a package...or even include it and add to the price of the cruise, thy are guaranteed profit.  Adding the gratuities is a winner--because they don't have to worry about some people stiffing the crew.  Internet is a no brainer.  They supply it and there is no added cost for extra use.

 

So, when it comes down to it, it's a no briner for the cruise line to go to All Inclusive--it's like pre-selling all of what used to be optional, in advance, to every cruiser.  And "I don't drink" means little--in their eyes, that's YOUR problem...There are probably lots of things onboard that many cruisers don't avail themselves of--and pay for those things anyway because the expense to the cruise line is already blended into the fares.

 

To the cruise line, if they fill up the ships, none of it will matter.  If they see sales decrease in any substantial way, perhaps they re-think it (why they left themselves the option of offering SOME no frills fares).  Now I am sure a lot of people think, "Well, of course we'll all start boycotting and their sales will go down and they will capitulate", however, there's a good chance there are a lot of folks who really don't compare prices that much...and just like the idea of everything being included.  For years I've been making the argument that the drink package, at the full price, is a BAD deal...that it's 6-7 drinks just to break even and you might as well just run the tab since you'll probably pay less.  And the answers always come back with "I don't care.  I just like not having to worry about what I'm spending every time I order a drink".  It's not really logical, but a whole lot of people like the idea.  Those people will also love the idea of All-Inclusive.

Well said.  On the flip-side, perhaps some of us in suites feel that we are paying for the elites et al who do not avail themselves of a suite and those perks that we pay for.  Those "freebies" gelato, CC glass of wine, ship photo, specialty coffee...all ship board costs are factored into EVERY level of cabin etc. Cruise lines know down to the penny what they need to do to make a profit.  I am OK with it, others clearly not so much, but for now, this is the way it is. 

[The_Big_M]

7 hours ago, Bruin Steve said:

The problem with that thinking is that, in exchange for all you've paid in cruise fares, you got to go on a lot of very nice cruises--which is exactly what you bargained for by buying the cruises.  Pay some money, go on the cruise.  That pretty much completes the contract.  

 

The problem with that thinking is that there is a significant cost and time effort in converting a lead just to make a sale. In addition there is the cost spent on many leads which don't even go on to a sale. Here you have significant income gained with minimal little effort. This has an earnings benefit to the corporation.

 

The poster said he was aware of the contractual obligations so this isn't about that. It's about the gain or loss of business from a high spending customer, and that impact magnified across many of them.

[Shadow9612]

On 11/21/2020 at 8:05 AM, wrk2cruise said:

 

The only answer you will receive for any FCC except those issued for 125% of a suspended cruise (by Celebrity) is NO.   These are the terms you signed up for when selecting a NRD.   The only thing I'd expect from Celebrity might be an extension due to the extended no sail period.

That's what I hope for....an extension.

 

I didn't think the NRD would be refunded.   

 

 

[jagoffee]

6 hours ago, Fouremco said:

Bookings without AI made after the 90 day mark are only available for select sailings.

For sure.  Only the ones that are available and perhaps need to have the price reduced.  Customers that are willing to pay more with get the better choice of categories and cabin locations by booking earlier.  There is nothing to stop Celebrity from offering the “90 day prior” less costly price earlier than 90 days if the cruise bookings are slow.  

5 hours ago, basenji56 said:

It looks like the classic drink package is around $59 per person per day on the 7 day cruises I looked up.  (not sure if the 18% tip is added to that amount).

 

Over $800 for the week.

 

Adding that amount into the cruise fare is definitely an annoyance to those of us who don't drink alcohol.  I do drink specialty coffees so it is a little less of a hit, but still, I would prefer to pay for those coffees out of pocket. (In the past, I would drink free specialty coffees at the Elite breakfast.  I would pick up a few free sodas at the Elite cocktail party in the afternoon).

 

I looked up the wifi packages.  The surf package is around $240 for a week for two.  With my elite discount, it would cost around $170.  (I do usually pay for the surf package).  If I didn't use the wifi, having to pay for that $240 would be an annoyance too.

 

If you are personally ok with an increased price of $1000 per week to include those two things, that's fine.  Most of the people who are dismissing the concerns already do pay for those things so it doesn't effect them.

 

But, try to see this from the point of view of people who don't use them and are seeing their cruise price increased around $150 a day. We are not just being whiners.  $150 per day is the price of a nice hotel room on the land.

 

It is just an assumption that some people are making that those level of costs will be added to the overall cost of the cruise.  This is an incorrect assumption IMO.  The market will dictate how much more if any that people are willing to pay.

I have seen many cases in the past with the 123, 123Go, and BBB where there was little or no increase when those perks were added.  Other times the increase was significant.  

Edited November 23, 2020 by jagoffee

[TeaBag]

3 hours ago, Bruin Steve said:

I am guessing that when a vaccine is in universal distribution, any of this "shorex only" talk will be gone.  That issue is only because people are looking for how to resume cruising while the pandemic is still running rampant.

I sincerely hope you are right.  Perhaps when COVID is not a threat to us all any more, many things will change.

[excitedofharpenden]

4 hours ago, LGW59 said:

Well said.  On the flip-side, perhaps some of us in suites feel that we are paying for the elites et al who do not avail themselves of a suite and those perks that we pay for.  Those "freebies" gelato, CC glass of wine, ship photo, specialty coffee...all ship board costs are factored into EVERY level of cabin etc. Cruise lines know down to the penny what they need to do to make a profit.  I am OK with it, others clearly not so much, but for now, this is the way it is. 

Is that how you feel?  That those of you who stay in suites are paying for the perks of others?

 

Phil 

[verizon]

11 hours ago, Fouremco said:

Bookings without AI made after the 90 day mark are only available for select sailings.

It will be All sailings because the sailing will be 25% Full from my prediction.

So I have no worry about this AI thing.

Edited November 23, 2020 by verizon

[Fouremco]

5 hours ago, verizon said:

It will be All sailings because the sailing will be 25% Full from my prediction.

So I have no worry about this AI thing.

With people itching to get back to cruising, the number of L&S'd cruises, people trying to use the huge number of FCC's issued by Celebrity this year, plus the requirement for ships to sail at less than full capacity, I doubt very much that Celebrity will have any difficulty reaching the reduced capacity ceiling any time soon. Consequently, select cruises offering AI-free bookings in the last 90 days will be few and far between for the immediate future IMO.

[Oceangoer2]

8 hours ago, excitedofharpenden said:

Is that how you feel?  That those of you who stay in suites are paying for the perks of others?

 

Phil 

Leading question.....?

[TeeRick]

8 hours ago, excitedofharpenden said:

Is that how you feel?  That those of you who stay in suites are paying for the perks of others?

 

Phil 

Phil, I routinely stay in suites.  I can assure you that this thought has never entered my mind at least.  Many of my Elite+ benefits are not used by me when I sail in a suite.  So what?  I really don't care.  Not sure why there is so much focus here on CC on what others get and don't get.  

[bigboofer]

If Celebrity wants to go Regent light (Regents includes everything at a very high price on a much smaller ship) that is their choice and its up to us to accept it and book or go elsewhere. But when you start charging a lot you better be ready to provide what you offer. Regent did until they where bought by Norwegian and many things changed for the worse.

 

Celebrity needs to understand that a loyalty program should be designed to encourage repeat bookings to enjoy a cruise and possibly attain the next level. If you pay a few extra dollars for the cruise the perks will make up the difference with a preceded value of the loyalty program. After all nothing is ever free.

 

My objection to the changes are the lack of transparency in what we are paying for whats is now being included. A drink packages adds nothing for me since I rarely use the three drinks at our two hour social. Adding the gratuities is a problem only because they are no longer a tip but a fee but they should tell us how much per day is being added. When Regent gave everybody free internet they didn't bother to increase band with so the whole system crashed so I hope Celebrity plans according.

 

The bottom line is changing the loyalty makes some of us "free agents" so in only looking at Celebrity we'll now look at other lines as well. They have the right to adjust the program any way they want but we can how and where we book our vacations. Sometimes a change costs much more than just leaving this alone.

[verizon]

GEN-X need high speed internet and I don't think Celebrity is ready yet.

No high speed internet means NO GEN-X.