Celebrity breach of contract.

[Andy&Mary Reno]

Ok  we were booked on a recent cruise, in the retreat. Celebrity changed the terms by removing  the Butler service. I felt it was handled poorly. I called to cancel  and rebook with anther line. I was told they didn't have to  do anything. I don't know any business that can offer something ,promoted as a major part of the Retreat experience  then take it away . without providing equal or greater value  replacement        

[leaveitallbehind]

Please correct me if I am wrong, but I thought the change with the butler service was from a dedicated butler for each sky suite to a team of butlers that split their time amongst all of the sky suites on a shared basis. (I believe higher end suites have retained the dedicated butler).  If so, although it would have not been a dedicated butler only to your suite, you still would have had butler service available.  Is that not correct?  I realize that is a recent change and I assume is not likely what you had expected with the original booking, but I don't believe they removed the service altogether.  Just looking for clarification.

Edited December 27, 2023 by leaveitallbehind

[cruisestitch]

1 hour ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

Ok  we were booked on a recent cruise, in the retreat. Celebrity changed the terms by removing  the Butler service. I felt it was handled poorly. I called to cancel  and rebook with anther line. I was told they didn't have to  do anything.

 

I don’t understand this last sentence. You were told by whom? You were told “they” didn’t have to do anything, who is “they”.? the butlers? The cruise line? The person you spoke to?  Can you clarify please?

 

 

 

 

[mom says]

You won't have your own personal butler, but you will have service by the butler team. So no, they aren't in breach of contract. I suggest you read the T&Cs you agreed to when you paid your deposit.

[leaveitallbehind]

1 hour ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

Ok  we were booked on a recent cruise, in the retreat. Celebrity changed the terms by removing  the Butler service.

Just further clarification.  You indicated you were booked on a recent cruise.  So that sounds like you have taken the cruise, correct?  If so, did you have some level of butler service in your sky suite? 

 

And what is your expectation with this complaint - are you looking for compensation or other restitution from Celebrity? Again, just curious.

Edited December 27, 2023 by leaveitallbehind

[Cap_D]

Not sure if posters here have all the realistic info, so if anyone is reading this and thinking there's a butler team that is wowing customers the reports are the team doesn't match up with what was provided pre cutbacks.  The butler team is in practice a head butler that may say hello once or so, and the overworked housekeeper / room attendant who cleans the room and other rooms that may or may not be in the Retreat.  There are many threads and first hand accounts that substantiate this regardless of title or what Celebrity says about the services continuing to be the same.  Those services included items that appear in bullet points and various other claims made by Celebrity in various places.  Those services also included the ability of the butler person to access the ships services, and use their discretion to serve the customer.  Whether the butler had provided all the services pre cutback is not relevant, but there are many reports of them being useful and available.  By and large the room attendant is not  providing all or any of the services, and the head butler is at best placing a room service order for coffee and often missing, according to many first hand reports.  Not commenting on the merits of a bait and switch or deceptive advertising claim. 

Edited December 27, 2023 by Cap_D

[ldubs]

2 hours ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

Ok  we were booked on a recent cruise, in the retreat. Celebrity changed the terms by removing  the Butler service. I felt it was handled poorly. I called to cancel  and rebook with anther line. I was told they didn't have to  do anything. I don't know any business that can offer something ,promoted as a major part of the Retreat experience  then take it away . without providing equal or greater value  replacement        

 

Do you mean you were unable to cancel the cruise?  Seems they would have no choice if before final payment.  Or, maybe there is a nonrefundable deposit.  It is not clear what was refused.  

[Andy&Mary Reno]

We had paid off the cruise way before  the "penalty period had just begun. Regardless they offered  FCC.  There was other issues. We have decided to retain Counsel. It seems to me. Celebrity wants to hold you to a contract that they breeched. Very one sided. I believe in principles and ethical practices, Celebrity doesn't.    

[Andy&Mary Reno]

2 hours ago, mom says said:

You won't have your own personal butler, but you will have service by the butler team. So no, they aren't in breach of contract. I suggest you read the T&Cs you agreed to when you paid your deposit.

No  the retreat already had a retreat concierge team  so no they didn't replace anything  They last time I checked Bait and switch is illegal.  

[Andy&Mary Reno]

2 hours ago, cruisestitch said:

 

I don’t understand this last sentence. You were told by whom? You were told “they” didn’t have to do anything, who is “they”.? the butlers? The cruise line? The person you spoke to?  Can you clarify please?

 

 

 

Celerity's own retreat team, and then the "executive office" told me personally  that removing the Butler service was fleet wide and, I quote, a financial decision

 

[Flatbush Flyer]

1 hour ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

We had paid off the cruise way before  the "penalty period had just begun. Regardless they offered  FCC.  There was other issues. We have decided to retain Counsel. It seems to me. Celebrity wants to hold you to a contract that they breeched. Very one sided. I believe in principles and ethical practices, Celebrity doesn't.    

You may want to reread your Ticket Contract and T&Cs. I expect you’ll find language that absolves the cruise line from responsibility for anything not directly related to the mechanical operation of the ship in the act of transporting you from Point A to Point B.

[chengkp75]

4 hours ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

We had paid off the cruise way before  the "penalty period had just begun. Regardless they offered  FCC.  There was other issues. We have decided to retain Counsel. It seems to me. Celebrity wants to hold you to a contract that they breeched. Very one sided. I believe in principles and ethical practices, Celebrity doesn't.    

When was the cruise?  Because the ticket contract states that you cannot bring any claim against the line unless you provide them a written, full, description of the claim within 15 days of the end of the cruise.

[omeinv]

4 hours ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

We have decided to retain Counsel.

I imagine Celebrity's legal team is quaking at the thought of going up against an attorney who's clients have decided to file their case in the District Court of Cruise Critic.

 

Harris

Denver, CO

Edited December 27, 2023 by omeinv

[The_Big_M]

6 hours ago, mom says said:

You won't have your own personal butler, but you will have service by the butler team. So no, they aren't in breach of contract. I suggest you read the T&Cs you agreed to when you paid your deposit.

 

That isn't correct - except it was as marketed that way by Celebrity spin so they avoided having people cancel.

 

There is no new "team" that has replaced the butler that was listed as part of the booking. The only replacement for the removed butler is a "head butler" who obviously is shared across tens of rooms, and already had other responsibilities so does not deliver anything that butlers did before to an individual suite. You will be unlikely to see him any more than once if at all, and he will have no involvement in the day to day operation of your suite.

 

All the other people involved in your service delivery are the same people who were involved when a butler existed, i.e. it is a loss or degradation of service that has not been replaced.

 

 

[Mark_K]

4 minutes ago, chengkp75 said:

When was the cruise?  Because the ticket contract states that you cannot bring any claim against the line unless you provide them a written, full, description of the claim within 15 days of the end of the cruise.

I kind of doubt that would be enforceable.  In any case, the OP doesn’t have much of a case, and the attorney fees are likely to be substantially more than any provable damages.

[cruisestitch]

OP  you were offered FCC.  Did you accept it?  

 

 

[hcat]

The issues raised here are pretty much "old news",  but will likely continue as people show up expecting to be greeted by their assigned butler, no longer available in lower suites

 

Most folks on CC have  already vented about the changes  made without compensation or an option to cancel,  and are now focused on relating  how their experience was under the new non butler system for SS.   Including neex to call  room service instead of Butler service, use of Reps in Retreat, etc.. Mostly negative from what I gather.

[Frenchkona]

As an attorney, you have two chances of going anywhere with this action, none and none. Use your time wisely. 

[mnocket]

It never fails to disappoint me how many cheerleaders will reflexively jump to side with the cruise lines against almost any complaint against the company. I don't know if Celebrity has the contractual right to change any or every aspect of their product after a customer has purchased it, or not. To me it really doesn't matter -  either way it's treating their customers wrong.  Something can be both legal and wrong. If the OP does indeed proceed with legal action, I hope they win - although I fear it will likely be throwing good money after bad. Still they have my support and gratitude for standing up against a company for doing wrong by their customers, because they know they can get away with it. It's sad to see so many side with the company🙁

[leaveitallbehind]

8 hours ago, ldubs said:

 

Do you mean you were unable to cancel the cruise?  Seems they would have no choice if before final payment.  Or, maybe there is a nonrefundable deposit.  It is not clear what was refused.  

You are correct that Celebrity has a non-refundable deposit policy with suites in that 100% of the deposit is forfeited with any cancelation - prior to or post final payment.  The deposit is also higher than that of standard staterooms. Obviously this can be a strong incentive to maintain a booking. But you can still cancel without further penalty prior to final payment. The fact that Celebrity offered an FCC IMO was at least a gesture to preserve that deposit and eliminate the penalty.

 

But on a sidenote, while this is a frustrating situation that may be seen as not handled well, it would only be that to those who booked that particular level of suite in the timeframe in which the program was changed after booking and prior to the cruise date.  They are the only ones who would be affected by this with a change in expectation of what they would benefit by with that suite level. 

 

And while this change in service may not be to the liking of those suite guests who had previously enjoyed it, the option to not book with Celebrity now would alleviate any frustration with the change in program with that level of suite.  The dollar can provide a powerful voice.

Edited December 27, 2023 by leaveitallbehind

[paulh84]

7 hours ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

No  the retreat already had a retreat concierge team  so no they didn't replace anything  They last time I checked Bait and switch is illegal.  

Check once again. That is not Bait and Switch. Your counsel can explain (at their hourly rate - of course). I’m not sure what law would require someone with the job title of butler to deliver your coffee rather than someone with job title of room service attendant but best of luck on the case. 

[sanger727]

We have found that the burden is on the customer to prove that an item is promised by the contract, not the other way around. We had a gym that we used to go to that convinced us to renew our contract early and then eliminated all finesses classes. When we argued with them that there was a contract breach, they gave us a copy and pointed out that the contract didn't guarantee fitness classes. It may have been and advertised service when we renewed - but it wasn't contractually guaranteed so it wasn't a breach of contract to eliminate them. There is always some standard contract language that the service provider can change what is offered at any time. 

[PTC DAWG]

7 hours ago, Andy&Mary Reno said:

We had paid off the cruise way before  the "penalty period had just begun. Regardless they offered  FCC.  There was other issues. We have decided to retain Counsel. It seems to me. Celebrity wants to hold you to a contract that they breeched. Very one sided. I believe in principles and ethical practices, Celebrity doesn't.    

I think you are wasting your $$$…not to mention your time. 

Edited December 27, 2023 by PTC DAWG

[jelayne]

10 hours ago, mom says said:

You won't have your own personal butler, but you will have service by the butler team. So no, they aren't in breach of contract. I suggest you read the T&Cs you agreed to when you paid your deposit.

There is no team of butlers for Sky Suites.  There is small number of butlers that take care of the Celebrity Suites and above, no change there.  There is 1 Head Butler that can’t possibly provide any level of daily service to the 140 -160 Sky Suutes.  

 

Sky Suites have a Retreat Host which is a title change from cabin attendant, with the same duties as any cabin attendant.
 

 In a Sky Suite if you want coffee, breakfast, snack you don’t call a butler you call Room Service, you do not have a butler to restock the mini bar you do that by going to the Retreat Lounge and getting the soda, water yourself;  want to make or change dinner, spa or excursions another dyi, or go to then retreat Lounge and wait in line for a Concierge to assist.  Want to have friends in for a pre dinner drink, no butler to provide glassware, napkins or arrange snacks or cheese and crackers, other than glassware another dyi.  

I think you get the idea.  These examples are things suite guests could do themselves but we paid an inflated price to have these things handled by someone else.  On E class ships with 140-160 SS the “Retreat Team” is not staffed to provide anywhere near the level of service as when there were Butlers.

 

[chuckroast1]

Have you actually found an attorney that would take your case?